Jayme >> Good afternoon, everyone. And I would like to welcome you to today's WISE Webinar. My name is Jayme Pendergraft. And I'm the Director of Communications and Outreach for Social Security's Ticket to Work Program. Thank you for joining us today. It's my pleasure to introduce today's moderator, Patricia Van Nelson. Pat is the Deputy Director of the Ticket Program Manager and has over 30 years of related experience to bring to today's topic and discussion. Pat, it's all yours.

Pat >> Thanks Jayme. Good afternoon everyone. And welcome to today's Ticket to Work Webinar, “Working for Yourself with Ticket to Work.” As Jayme said, my name is Pat Van Nelson. And I'm a member of the Ticket to Work team. And I'll be moderating today. On behalf of Social Security and the entire Ticket team, thank you for joining us to learn about the program. We chose today's topic, “Working for Yourself with Ticket to Work” because it's a question we receive frequently. And it may not get enough attention. People often ask if the Ticket Program includes self-employment? And how to get started on that path. Well, the short answer is yes it does. And we'll be giving you some more information about that later today. One thing you'll probably take away from this session, in case you don't already know this, is that you decided to choose self-employment is a very personal choice. 
Once you've decided that you want to work, whether that means you're at the start of a career, or changing your previous career, you're probably going to have to make some choices. Are you going to look for a job? Or does the idea of having your own business seem more appealing? There are so many things to consider in choosing to work for yourself. What do you want to do? Is there a market for your product or your services? Can you earn enough money? Our presenter will cover many of these questions. But one of our principle goals today is to make sure that you know, that there are people that can help you think through those questions. And if you do decide that self-employment is for you, we'll point you to resources that can help you with practical aspects of establishing your own unique business model. Because some of you may be new to our webinars, we'll also take some time to introduce you to the Ticket Program, and other Work Incentives. The Ticket Program service providers can be your first line resources to help you navigate the workforce. Whether that's working for yourself or working for someone else. Some of you probably already know how unique the Ticket Program is. Maybe you've read some of the stories on our website. You found all sorts of people who despite their disabilities, decided they wanted to work to become financially independent. And when they joined forces with the Ticket Program and their service providers, they made that a reality. The Ticket Program recognizes we're all different. We have our own skills, our own needs, our own dreams. And everyone of us gets to decide our own path. In the context of today's webinar, what that means is that you're considering self-employment, we've got some answers and ideas to help you make that decision. So let's get started. 
As we usually do, before we jump into the heart of today's presentation, we want to make sure that you can get the most out of the information we're going to share. So what we have to talk about this webinar platform. First there's the audio. You can manage your audio using the audio option at the top of your screen. The audio option is an icon. It looks like a speaker. When you click on it there's a drop down menu. Select speaker for the menu options, just like on the screen. Just as a reminder, everyone attending will be muted. Except of course for me, and our presenter. When it asks how you want to join the meeting’s audio, pick device speaker if you want the sound to come through your computer. And be sure to turn on your speakers or plug in your headphones. If you'd rather listen by phone, you can dial 1-800-832-0736 and enter access code 418148 and the pound sign. 
You can also use the join the meeting audio to receive a phone call as you'll see in the image on the screen and enter that same number and access code. On the Adobe Connect platform you'll notice different boxes on your screen. And for some reason those boxes are called pods, and that's how we refer to them. We have the presentation pod, and that's where the slides appear. That's the largest portion of your screen. Below that is an open space for closed captioning. The top right corner is a Q & A pod and below that is the Web Links pod. And need assistance navigating the platform there's an accessibility user guide that has a list of controls. It's available on the website at http://bit.ly//adobe-accessibility. A link to this guide is also available in the Web Links pod at the bottom right of your screen. It's called Adobe Accessibility User Guide. So if you want that one, you can go to the Web Links pod and access it now. 
Real time caption is available. It's displayed in the captioning pod below the slides. You can show or hide the captioning display, and you can also choose the size and color of the text to meet your own vision preference. To open/close captioning, select the CC option in the top menu bar. The captioning link can also be found in the Web Links pod under the title web captioning. You can also access captioning online in a separate viewing window. Choice is up to you and how you want to see it. 
If you're fluent in American sign language, and you'd like support during today's webinar, you can follow the link that provides instructions on how to connect with an interpreter through the Federal Communications Commissions video relay service. The ASL User Guide is also available in the Web Links pod. We're going to be pausing to answer your questions at two different points in the webinar. You can send your questions to us any time during the webinar just by typing them in the Q & A pod. I'll direct questions to our presenter during the Q & A portions of the webinar. And my job is to get to as many of those questions as possible in the time we have. If you're listening by phone, you can ask your questions by sending an email to webinars@choosework.ssa.gov. I've also - already referred you to the Web Links pod a couple times. That's where you'll find all the links for the resources we'll cover today. Just select the ones that interest you. If you're listening by phone, you can email webinars@choosework.ssa for a list of those resources. You can also find them in your confirmation email for today's webinar. 
As a reminder Social Security can't guarantee and isn't responsible for the accessibility of external websites. We're recording today's webinar. So if you miss something, and you want to go back, listen again or you know someone who couldn't attend today, we'll be posting it within two weeks on the Choose Work Website. At https -- I don't know how many T's I said. https://bit.ly/wise_ondemand. And this link is also available in the Web Links pod called Wise Webinar Archives. We hope you have a good experience during the webinar and your technology cooperates with you. However, if you do run into technical difficulties, you can use the Q & A pod to send us a message, or you can email us at that site I gave you before webinars@choosework.ssa.gov and our team will help you. 
In a minute you'll hear from my colleague and today's presenter Derek Shields. You may already know Derek from previous webinars. And know that he's spent the past 28 years working in the areas of disability employment, accessibility and reasonable accommodations. What you may not know is that Derek is also self-employed. He's President of ForwardWorks Consulting, a professional services firm, specializing in disability inclusion, veterans integration and using transition services. Derek has a master's degree in management and disability services from the University of San Francisco in addition to his contributions to the Ticket Program, he's also a co-founder and advisor of National Disability Mentoring Coalition. I expect Derek will share some of his own experience of what it's like to be an entrepreneur and start your own business. I'll be back with you during the question and answer sessions, so remember to put your questions in the Q & A pod. It's now my pleasure to turn the microphone over to Derek.

Derek Shields >> Thank you so much for the welcoming remarks and the generous introduction and setting the stage for us today. It's my pleasure to be with you, and with all of our attendees who have this interest in the topic of working for yourself with Ticket to Work. And one of my passionate - areas of passion is entrepreneurship as you mentioned. And I will be sharing some thoughts on my experiences, and really trying to connect to you out there that have an interest in self-employment. And perhaps a little bit of a pathway of entrepreneurship that you're thinking about taking. 
Today we're going to cover these four areas for our Wise Webinar. We always cover Social Security Ticket to Work Program. Making sure we know how to ensure we know our eligibility and what the program can offer. And then we're going to go into the real subject at hand. Why consider self-employment, looking at advantages and disadvantages of self-employment. And then the third area, who can help you achieve your self-employment goals? So those are the four sections of our presentation. And I do encourage you to submit your questions so Pat can bring those up at the two points that she mentioned, that we'll be pausing for Q & A. So thanks a lot everybody for joining us for this session and we're going to get started. 
First, Social Security's Ticket to Work Program. You know this program is - serves individuals that are receiving Social Security Disability Benefits. So if you're one of those individuals then the Ticket Program, you could be eligible for. But to know about these programs is really important. So we'll take a couple minutes to start out by reviewing these two benefits programs. To begin, let's talk about Social Security Disability Insurance, what we call SSDI. This is a program that people have paid into while working. If you have worked, then you likely had something called FICA taxes withheld from your paycheck. And that's what's actually funding this disability insurance benefit. So you're paying into it, thus you have the insurance. And the amount of benefits for your insurance benefits, is going to depend on a few things, including how - and how much you've earned, and really what was withheld for those FICA taxes along the way. There's a maximum amount to this. And it's important that everyone knows that. Everyone's benefit is different. What one person might have is going to be different than the others. And just really recall that this is insurance. And when you've worked in the past and you've paid in the program, then you know SSDI becomes available to you, if needed. With the program, we don't really care about resources. This isn't about unearned income that you may have. It's the insurance program, you worked, you paid into it. 
Now we need to contrast that to the other benefit program, Supplemental Security Income or SSI. This is a needs-based program that Social Security provides to people who have not worked enough to be insured. So if you haven't worked enough or perhaps you never worked, you wouldn't have access to the disability insurance benefit. So it is very, very different. And it's going to look to see if you have very low resource amounts. And low income amounts. So as I mentioned, Social Security administers both of these programs. And for SSI, Social Security pays monthly benefits to people with limited income and resources that are either blind or have a qualifying disability. There are a couple other groups that could receive SSI, folks that are over 65 and older are - could receive it and children with disabilities or children who are blind may also have access to SSI, so a couple other groups. Probably not looking at self-employment like most of you today. But important to know they could be eligible as well. 
So with this in mind, it's important to know about the benefit programs, but also to know which ones that you might be eligible for, or you may be receiving. So if you're not sure, what we do is recommend that you sign up for a "my social security" account. You can look up really your eligibility or status with these - in one of these accounts. We call them "my SSA accounts". These accounts have to be set up via the Social Security website, where they're going to ask for some personal information. This is a highly safe and secure site. And this account will give you the information about your work history. So if you've worked in the past, and you've been paying those FICA taxes, you can see the record of that work history. It's also going to tell you if you're eligible for SSDI, how much you may be receiving, and it can give you some information about what your dependents could receive as well. I do look at mine from time to time, it's not difficult to set up. And you can log in and check out - I tend to do it at the end of the year, kind of seeing what the status is. You can find your projected disability benefits. I can also access my eligibility for benefit status. On the SSI side it - these accounts help clarify that your benefits are SSI, and how much those benefits are. And have really good information for both the SSDI and SSI information that's going to help you on your journey to work, including self-employment. You may talk to a member of your Employment Team, like a benefits planner. and they're going to need that information so having some of that basic information will really be useful. If you don't have one of these accounts yet, I really recommend it. You can sign up for the My Social Security account. You can either do an internet search or go to SSA.gov/myaccount and you know learn more about it there. And begin the process. We also have it in the Web Links pod number eight, and you can select that and access the information. 
So that's a little bit about the benefit programs and checking on your eligibility there through my SSA account. With that in mind, let's now turn to the Ticket to Work Program. With the Ticket Program, this is a free and voluntary program serving people ages 18 through 64, who are receiving a disability benefit from Social Security, either SSDI or SSI that I just covered. And are interested in working. So those are really the only requirement, receiving a benefit, one or the other or both, SSDI and SSI. And you're age 18 through 64. And you're interested in working. So with that in mind, you know if that sounds like you, there are some great services that are available to help you in your journey to work. And that includes self-employment or working for yourself. And when we talk about it, Pat mentions it, sometimes we don't focus on this area as much. Because well, not as many people are self employed. But if this is - sounds like the right thing for you, then you should know if you're eligible for the Ticket Program, all of the services that come with it, along with the supports, can help you on your journey to work through self employment. The Ticket Program is available and provides you with these free employment services. I mentioned them: services and support. So I wanted to talk to you a little bit about what those are, just so you have awareness. And then we'll get into the self-employment content. You know the first area is really in that choice. If you are questioning returning to work or trying work for the first time, like we need to be able to have advisors out there, people that can assist you in determining what exists. Including working for yourself and what that will look like in terms of transitioning from being on the benefits, to transitioning off of that. And what will happen to your healthcare coverage in that process too? So you can get that information from a service provider that will help you decide if work is right for you. And only you can make that choice. 
Once you know, you're deciding to work, then you - we kind of have these three next areas. And we'll go through each of them. The second one being preparing for work. You know somebody might need some more preparation, and getting from where you might be right now to where you want to be. And the Ticket Program can greatly assist. There's a lot of educational preparation, things like training or certification programs that are available. Other people might need access to rehabilitative preparation. And the Ticket Program can do this, and does do this for many people. In terms of preparing for self employment you can actually discuss how to prepare for being like an independent consultant or contractor or a business owner. What steps do I need to take in order to take this path to employment? And the Employment Team, the different providers that are out there are prepared to assist. 
The third area is helping you find a job, finding that paid work opportunity. Or, in this case, perhaps self employment. the service providers, including these groups that we call Employment Networks, are available to talk about this. And they're experts in it. So they know how to assist you and thinking about self employment as an option. And then talking you through those steps. And so you know, we'll dig into some of those specific types of help as we go through the rest of the content today, focused on self employment. 
The final area of course, is exceeding at work. And this is very important. As an entrepreneur if you're going to start down the path towards self employment we want to see you transition from trying work to potentially doing something part-time to moving into full-time, to moving into achieving their business goals or your self employment goals. And the Ticket Program can really bring all the services to support that transition and bring that - that vision of yours to reality. So keep that in mind. We do have in the Web Links pod, at item number 10, the tutorial. That will really take you through these four steps, if you want to explore more about the Ticket Program. We encourage you to visit that online. Access that through Web Links pod number 10. And the last beat on the Ticket to Work Program if you're not sure, what we do is recommend to give our Ticket to Work helpline a call. You can verify your eligibility for the program. You can ask the beneficiary support specialist that staff the helpline questions about how the program works. And if you heard me say something that you're like, well what did he mean by services and supports, they could provide some more details for you on that too. They're open Monday through Friday, 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. Eastern Time. We have a couple of numbers here for you, 1-866-968-7842. That's the telephone line. And then the TTY line is 1-866-833-2967. And as I mentioned earlier if you have a Social Security - a My Social Security account, you can also check on your benefits status there. But you know, what we really recommend… if you're unsure of where to start, give the Ticket to Work helpline a call. Those folks are trained and ready to support you. 
Okay so we've covered the first section of the content, and that's the Ticket Program. And appreciate you going through that with us, so we can all have that as our foundation. Now we're going to transition over to our focus for today, and that's working for yourself. This is an area that I am familiar with as Pat mentioned. I've spent the last 10 years or so as part of a small group that decided to start and build a company. And you know when I was starting my career I didn't really have this as part of the vision. But as I spent most of those 28 years building a lot of capabilities, I also had a slightly different approach to what I wanted to do. So I'll be referring back to my experiences as an entrepreneur as we go through the content. And hope that some of my experiences could help some of you in thinking about is self employment a direction that I care to go down? And is entrepreneurship part of me? You know we describe ourselves in a lot of different ways. But if you have a desire to do this, there is a path to financial self-sufficiency through self employment. And that's what we are going to explore now. For some of us, we might hear self employment and it can mean different things to different people. And you know it is working for yourself. Like the title of this WISE webinar has. But there's some different ways that you can make that a reality. So we start out with owning a business. And this is really a classic form of entrepreneurship. And you know of course there's different classifications for businesses. You can incorporate, you can open up a limited liability capability or an LLC. We're not going to get into the details of different business types and the steps to open them today. But let's categorize that. This is one option. You're an entrepreneur and you have an idea for a business, that could be a great path. There's two other pathways though that I'll refer to today, and these are great paths and options for people as well. The second one is working as an independent consultant. You may hear this referred to as a 1099 consultant or contractor. And this is an individual 1099 comes from the tax form, as opposed to W-2 withholding's. So that's where we got that term. As an independent consultant, you could be on a team where the majority of people may be working for the employer. And then you're an independent consultant to that employer. But you could be embedded with all those team members, and providing similar supports and services that the team is doing. That's just a different option for your consideration. The last one we call a freelancer. This is a little bit more like hopping from small job to small job. I know people that do this in a variety of fields. And they end up having many different experiences with different clients and projects. 
A couple examples are I work closely with a graphic designer, and she is a freelancer. She might work more long-term on some projects with me. But then I won't work with her again for you know, that maybe for a month we'll work together. And then I won't work with her again for two years. Well in the meantime, she's picking up jobs to help someone's logo design. Or she might pick up a job to help develop a fact sheet as a graphic designer. There's others that do accessibility work, you know I can be a freelancer. And I know how to use a screen reader, I could do testing and provide feedback on accessibility of documents. So that's another freelance area. I'm also familiar that you know with a lot of editors that do freelance editing work. So those are some examples. You might have one that works for you. These are different approaches to self employment, but all lead us to the same result. And it's all self employment. 
So with that in mind we wanted to cover some - some data about self employment. The Bureau of Labor Statistics expects self employment job opportunities to grow by 7.9% by the year 2026, 10 year looking there. Compared to 7.4% growth for all workers. Making this a faster growing section, right? 7.9% compared to 7.4 for all workers. So, and inside of all these self employment jobs we see fast growing ones being construction workers, child care workers, hair stylists, real estate agents and management analysts. So maybe one of those areas is of interest to you. And it's really good to consider that self employment is growing faster. And that these jobs are leading the way. Because there's going to be a higher demand for them. If you want to dig into this Bureau of Labor Statistics information, you can learn more in the Web Links pod. That's item number 11. 
Okay so thinking of that data and thinking about the different types of self employment, we pulled together some considerations for you when thinking about that self employment, because there sure is a lot to think about. It's kind of like when you look at working for somebody else and you start looking at job postings. You know, like overwhelmed by the number. Well when you consider self employment, you're not relying on all those job posts, but you have to do a lot of internal thinking and planning. So here we've presented seven questions that will help you think through is this right for me. With that we have the first, what interests you? What are your skills? Your current skills that could translate into a marketable business? That's a big question. Like do you have an idea that is unique? Something that you think could be marketable? And that needs to have that idea at the center of it, and that people or the marketplace would need. So we need to do some research and kind of start building that case. Next, this question: what services will you offer? These services are the things you're good at doing. And that leads to this next question, who will buy these services or things that you're good at doing? If we think of being a hair dresser, and you have a training or a certification as a hair dresser, what market or area are you considering? And is that area really in need of another hair dresser? So if the answer is yes, are you able to get a chair, you know in the store to be that either business owner or a single chair in the store as more of an independent contractor. And will you be getting hours that are the right time to make the business that you need? So you'd have to make a plan and figure that out. So that would allow for you to see, you know if I had that amount of sales then what does success look like? And this question we think about how much you have to earn to get to the point where you're covering your expenses, your breakeven point. And another question we could look at is what happens if it doesn't work out? You know what's your back up plan? Your plan B. So if you became the hair dresser and you were in what you thought was the right market, and you had the hours but you didn't get the customers, can you try to do it somewhere else? Can you turn to another form of employment or could you bring in a partner? So in that business plan thinking through what we would call the risk and developing a bit of a risk mitigation plan to look at different ways to get to the end goal. 
Next, are you ready? All these things we've talked about would inform the business plan and we're going to talk about that in a little bit more detail shortly. What expenses will you have? Do you have enough money to cover start up and maintain the business? And importantly, how can Social Security help? What do you need from your Employment Team, those service providers and what Work Incentives that Social Security offers. And we'll discuss these in a little bit more detail later today. But these areas where you can get support will help you find your success. So yes, you have to do a lot of thinking, there is a team that can help you in that process. And these are all hard and important questions. But if you can start answering them now, and forming your thoughts, then when you bring in this Employment Team, then this will help you further your journey towards self employment. I mentioned the business plan. And when considering self employment is the right option for you, it's important to think about that business plan. As you'll find out, most of these options that we're talking about with the Ticket Program require a business plan. So this is important to think about your transition to financial self sufficiency through the program. It's a requirement. But we also look at it as a best practice for entrepreneurship. So if you're starting the business, we can think about it in that model. But I would tell you, you could also use a plan to become independent consultant or a freelancer, the same structure would help getting your ideas down on the paper, that's going to help you think about your goals. And probably continuously rethink them. That will allow you to think about well how did I bring that product or service that's my unique idea. What I'm good at to the market. And then when we dig in deeper, what those financial projections will look like. If you are a consultant or a freelancer, compared to the business owner, you also need to think about how to price yourself. How much am I going to charge per hour? And how am I going to market myself, so people can find me? So if you know, it's technically a business plan could be defined as a guide for how to structure, run and grow a business. In this case a new business. And then how are you going to operate? When you grade at these formal sections could be in there, executive summary, a description that could include a mission statement and you know kind of core service areas with descriptions of what those are and how you - they would work. Of course a marketing plan with a supporting sales section. This is the target audiences and here is how we're going to take our unique value proposition and position ourselves in the marketplace. Who are we trying to approach with what? And then in the end the financial projections. And that can be challenging, certainly has been one of my challenging areas because I'm really not a numbers person. I'm more of a - I guess a people person. So accounting and financial management is - hasn't been my strong suits. So I've had to partner with some folks there. There's a - in the Web Links pod, item number 12 there's access to this write your business plan tool from the US Small Business Administration. So we encourage you to check that out. If you haven't done a business plan before, we have a lot of resources for you. That's one, definitely check it out. 
Okay, we're moving in now to benefits of self employment. And we're going to look at 11 benefits of self employment. A couple of them we'll breeze through. A couple of them we'll say a couple more words on. One, you're more in control. When you choose self employment you control your time, you control your decisions and who you work with. Who your clients are, who you hire, who you partner with. Next you know if you're passionate about what you do then you can put the passion right at the center of your mission. You don't have to bolt it on later. It can be right in the middle. So I learned a lot from people that you know, that taught me that I was really passionate about inclusive employment opportunities. And yet I wasn't in control of my time. So when we started this company, I was able to be in control of my time and spend more of my time focused on my passion around inclusion and employment. Third, you can potentially make your own work schedule. I like that one. You know some people say that entrepreneurs work too much, you know too many hours. That can be true. I also know entrepreneurs that work three days a week. So it's really designing a model that works for you, and you can control it. Number four, you may be able to choose your own co-workers and determine your work environment. Kind of mentioned that one. I think determine your work environment is you know compared the reporting to an office. You may be able to have a work from home opportunity. And number five, you have some creative control working for yourself does allow you to have more creative control, to a degree. Until you know, your clients have requirements. So it's a bit of a balance there. But bringing your passion and creativity to a product or service you know, that's recognized by the community, you can control how that happens. And sometimes when we work for other people we don't have that. On the next page here, we have the final 11, there's six here. Number six, grow your skill set and knowledge base. When you're self employed, you can be confronted with unfamiliar processes, especially in the beginning. I've learned a great deal by being an entrepreneur and having to confront everything I don't know. It happens every week. I always learn something and self employment can be a great match for folks that have intellectual curiosity, because it isn't the same thing every day or every week. On number seven, identify and choose your own reasonable accommodations. This is great for people with disabilities who are self employed, because if you're in charge, you don't have to submit a request for reasonable accommodation that can be denied. You're able to create your own. On number eight, choose what you outsource to others. This is a choice that I mentioned I'm not great around accounting and financial management. So I've outsourced that at times in the past to freelancers. And now we have somebody who is inside the company that does that. On number nine, get the potential financial rewards. This can be possible, also suggest that you know in start up years it isn't likely and things can be lean. But in the end there are many entrepreneurs who move forward and get great financial rewards. And then 10 and 11, the second to last one, enable variety in your routine. I find this the most valuable on the list. Every day is different. Every week is different. And it connects to the last one for me. Building meaningful networks. Because I have the opportunity to do work in different communities and spaces with different clients and customers. I'm able to access a broader perspective of disability inclusion and community participation from early intervention, to transition from school to work. To Social Security Benefit programs and beyond. And it allows me to think about solutions across that spectrum. So those are 11 benefits. There are some potential disadvantages. Of course lack of a stable income. A high failure rate for new businesses. These are true, and sometimes you do have to work long hours. But if it's a passion, then it could be a trade off. Of course, finding clients and customers for paid opportunities can be consuming of your time. So you have to balance between doing the work and marketing. And that can lead to high levels of stress. Some people thrive on that. If that's not you, then you might say let me talk about the self employment option, but let me keep other traditional options open too. And last, expenses such as business licenses, insurances, tax and legal considerations are complicated. They're real and they seem to be different in every state. And they seem to evolve all the time. So entrepreneurs have to stay up on those. And as soon as you think you've got it all, then you're investing more time and sometimes expenses to follow along. So these are some disadvantages to be considering along with the potential benefits that I covered as well. So I'm going to stop here. We're going to bring Pat in for our first Q & A. And see what kind of questions folks have out there. Pat?

Pat >> Thanks Derek. We've got several questions. Some are about the Ticket Program and some are more specifically about self employment. Starting with the Ticket Program ones, we got one it's sort of a two partner. The first question is does it matter whether you're on Social Security Disability Insurance, or if you're on Supplemental Security Income to join the Ticket Program? Does that matter?

Derek >> Good question. No it does not matter. You need to be on one or the other, or both. So receiving the Social Security Benefit. And then you're eligible for the program. So as long as you're age 18 through 64.

Pat>> Got it. And the second question, second part of that question is how can they find out whether they receive SSI or SSDI?

Derek >> Excellent. This is Derek again. So there are some options there. I'm going to give you three, well two I already mentioned. But there's one I didn't. It's probably best to always discuss these items with the Social Security representative. So if you have questions about your benefits that you're receiving, you can always call Social Security directly. They have a toll free number: 1-800-772-1213. Or, they have a TTY line 1-800-325-0778. They operate 8 a.m. to 7 p.m. Monday through Friday Eastern Time. So that's the Social Security representatives I mentioned already. We have the Ticket to Work help line. Those are beneficiary support specialists. They can review your benefit status and provide a lot of information on the Ticket to Work Program. But they will refer you over to Social Security just to ensure you have the most updated benefit status information. And that last one, I also mentioned before, you can check on your My Social Security account, the My SSA account. And in there you can print a benefits verification letter that includes your SSI and/or SSDI benefit status. So if you do have benefits, that's a great way to find out too. Three options. You can't go wrong with either of them. But when in doubt calling Social Security is a smart move.

Pat >> Thanks Derek. Our next question comes from someone who says they'd like to start a business, but they're not sure if it would be successful. They want to know if there is some way to figure that out?

Derek >> This is Derek again. Yeah, I love that and I chuckle a little bit because I asked myself the same question probably about 16, 17 years ago. And the answer is yes. You know you have to conduct what we could call a little research or a feasibility study. And it doesn't have to be as formal as one might think. But to put this together to see how your business might do. That can start by you know, writing down well this is what I'm going to sell. And then you can look at who is selling that. How are they doing? Who is buying it? And so in a sense you're doing a competitor analysis. You could also look at the market and determine what the need for that service or product is. And what are some other factors? So if you wanted to - if you're good at programming and you had an idea around artificial intelligence being applied to an industry that hasn't happened yet, well there might be a need for that, and you might be able to make a good business case. So I would suggest start by asking people you trust, friends, neighbors, others. Like would they be interested in what you're doing? And then you can look around on social media. You can look around on websites and other small businesses to really get a feel for what your business is. And could it do well. And start to really listen to people, get their feedback. And you know if somebody says, you know negative things to you, take that input as okay, I must have something I got to work on. I'm either not describing it the way that I need to be, or I haven't figured out exactly what my secret kind of idea is that's innovative enough to get more interest. And keep evolving. That would be my suggestion. But we can all start. What I would suggest is get the paper out and start putting your ideas down, and then talk to folks you trust. And they will help you evolve as you go forward.

Pat >> Thanks Derek. Hey you know, you talked about a business plan and I think it might have scared somebody. Because someone wants to know if they need to have a business degree to be self employed?

Derek >> This is Derek. I understand the question and the concern too. So the answer is no. You don't need a business degree to be self employed. I would also suggest that business degrees aren't going to harm you. If you have one, you're going to learn a lot. Listen, I got a management degree from the University of San Francisco. And one of my peers when we graduated, said "I just got a management degree, and I still don't know how to write a business plan.” So in my management school they didn't teach us how to write business plans. I would suggest that you learn a lot from the resources that we have today on writing business plans. And know that there are plenty of people out there that are self employed, that don't have management or business degrees. So you know there are some examples and we'll get more templates for you, and I'll mention some more resources later on. I would suggest you consider entrepreneur organizations or groups, like networking groups of entrepreneurs. Because everyone is grappling with the same questions. How do I start? How do I stay relevant? And surrounding yourself with other people that think like that is a really healthy tactic. My friends that are entrepreneurs, we support and prod and push each other. So I would ask you, well who is going to be that group? And you know, a little side story I'll tell you, you know there's a pretty famous person who didn't have a business degree. Who is a very successful business person, it's Sir Richard Branson. He's the head of Virgin Group and he dropped out of university because it wasn't his thing as a dyslexic person. Tests and those types of scores just didn't work for him. But he knew he thought differently. So you know he took that as an advantage. And started to rethink different sectors, starting with the music industry and now expanding years later into the travel, airline and cruise industry. So keep that in mind, you know and what's really important to me is that whether you're going to own a business like Sir Richard or be an independent consultant or freelancer, having that plan is your framework for success. So you know I started my plan in a notebook 20 years ago. This 15 pages every month or so I'd write ideas down. And I look back on it and the - the core ideas for the business came from that. So I encourage you if you're thinking about this, put it down. I use something now called strategy on a page, because 80 pages of notes was too much. What works for you might be different than what worked for me, but I would encourage you to give it a try.

Pat >> Thanks Derek. I appreciate the fact that you were able to narrow something down from 80 pages. Another person is asking about things you mentioned like licenses and taxes. Do they need a lawyer to start their business?

Derek >> This is Derek again. Yeah in most cases the answer is going to be probably not. It could be a maybe. We can't really tell you though whether you need a lawyer or not. We're not really here for legal advice. With that in mind though, I suggest the answer is just going to depend on what business model you select. If you're going to be a hairdresser as an independent consultant, you might need to be trained and certified. And you would need a license to practice in your state. You probably don't need a lawyer for that - that road map to work. You could work as an independent contractor with an established salon. You might have to negotiate a contract for that. In that case if you're not familiar with contracts, you might want to have a lawyer review it. Just to make sure that you feel like you're safeguarded. In the same example, if you decide that you're going to be the business owner of a salon, well it's pretty important to have individuals that are experts and business licensing and really looking at the expenses and the connect to taxes and reporting. So there, having some legal counsel involved, maybe some legal counsel that is familiar with accounting would be a great idea. So in all these cases you have to make your own choices. But hopefully some of those examples we kind of meet you where you are. And you know having access to a lawyer that is different than using a lawyer. So creating a relationship with one so you can tap into it when needed. That's a good idea too.

Pat >> Thanks Derek. We probably need to move on to the next part of your presentation. But I do want to remind folks that we've got another Q & A session coming up. So if you'd like to keep those good questions coming, we'd appreciate it. So go ahead Derek.

Derek >> Thanks Pat. So we're going to move into the next section of putting it altogether. And in this section we're going to say where do we actually get started and we have some more questions for you to think about. I think we're going to fill you up with a lot of good questions today. So we have three kind of categories of questions. What type of self employment do you want to pursue? And with that do you want to open a business, be a freelancer? Maybe an independent consultant. Next what type of services or products are you going to offer? And last where will you work? Is this going to be a place like an office or a store? Or a shared office environment or will this be a work from home engagement. And so with that in mind, those are good three questions to have for your framing. And it allows them to say well who can help you in achieving your self employment goals? And with this, you know we really want to think about the different service providers that are out there and the types of services and supports for self employment goals that can be offered. We have Employment Networks, that support Ticket to Work ticketholders. And we also have Vocational Rehabilitation agencies in each state. And these organizations can provide free services. And we have a list here. Starting with help in writing that business plan. In fact, we know of some Employment Networks that specialize in just doing that. And that can be you know, it's a challenging task. I'd give you some examples about creating concepts and goals. But for me, you know I got pretty good at doing that. But it took a while of practicing. And then you know in other areas like marketing strategies or connected to market realities so if you haven't done that before, the service provider can really help and give you feedback on your plan too. They can also assist in identifying funding resources. You know so if your business plan says you need some start up money, then they can provide some ideas and finding those options. 
The third one finding business mentors. This is a really important one, I mentioned a few times where I've tapped into people that I've trusted for certain areas like accounting, and finances too. I've had several business mentors and from my experiences, it's really helpful to get you to focus. Like the sounding boards, but they're also people that you feel hold you accountable to your own plan. And so if you're able to have some business mentors that are also entrepreneurs, including disabled entrepreneurs then you could really get a good group of advisors where you have mentorship, but you also support one another. Some other areas include access to training programs or certifications. Helping you understand the Work Incentives that are available to you. Some of which we're going to cover in a moment. And importantly, they can also help in identifying types of reasonable accommodations. So you might like all these service areas and ideas. But please note that not every provider is going to offer the exact same service. So when you're looking at an Employment Network or the Vocational Rehabilitation agency, you should ask them some questions about do you provide these types of services because I'm looking for self employment, and this is what I need to support me. 
All right, I mentioned Work Incentives. Now we're going to turn to that content about what are Work Incentives? And for this, these Incentives make it easier for people with disabilities to work and still receive medical benefits. And in some cases, benefits payments from Social Security. Work Incentives can also help you through the transition to work and that full financial independence you're seeking. And they allow you to do the things that we have listed on this slide. Receiving training for new skills. Improving your skills you already have. Or beyond training, pursuing education in case you wanted to access kind of a new path to employment or self employment. And you needed a degree, Work Incentives allow you to try different jobs. To start a career including self employment and really to gain confidence. And you know we talk about Work Incentives a lot, of course this is a Work Incentive seminar. And if you want to learn about the Work Incentives, we have a link on this slide. You can learn more at the Web Links pod number 15 about all of the Work Incentives that are available to you. And those resources would lead you over to more details from the Social Security Administration. Today we're going to focus in on self-employment-related Work Incentives. We're going to call out three that we have, that we don't talk about very often on these WISE webinars. The first one being the plan to achieve self support. We call that PASS. The second one being Property Essential for Self-Support or PESS and the third one being Unincurred Business Expenses. That is UBE. So you can access more information on these links. And you can get those through our Web Links pod number 16, 17 and 18. So there are a lot of resources out there that can help in the implementation of these. But what we want to do is now go into each one of these in a little bit more detail, so if you aren't familiar with them, you'll have more understanding. 
The first one is the Plan to Achieve Self Support or PASS. And if you receive SSI or can become eligible for SSI, a PASS planner or Plan to Achieve Self Support allows you to set aside income or resources to use for your career goals. The details on the slide really help tell you - spell out what needs to happen. It has to include a written plan. And that plan needs to be approved by Social Security. And this will help you achieve that specific work goal. So while you have that PASS plan in place, Social Security allows you to set aside money to pay for the items or services you need, to achieve your work goal. So this Work Incentive allows for more financial flexibility. It's important to note that Social Security does not count the income or assets you set aside, while on the PASS when they determine your eligibility for Supplemental Security Income, or SSI. Or how much you will receive each month if you are already receiving SSI. So this is an important flexibility as I mentioned. Many people use the PASS plan to pay for these things that are listed here: educational costs, a computer for either school or work, transportation costs or as we're talking about today, start up costs for a business. So those importantly can be rolled in as into your PASS plan and not counting. What you also need though to include a business plan, so we keep talking about it, it's so important that business plan. So they really are great option, PASS plans and - but they can be complicated. So we encourage you to get help in writing your plan. And you can learn more about creating and using your PASS plans through these two links we have on the screen, access through the Web Links pod at number 19 and number 20. So check those out to learn more about the PASS plan. And you can always talk to one of our service provider team members to learn more too. 
On the next slide for this next Work Incentive the Property Essential to Self Support or the PESS, P-E-S-S, is for individuals who receive SSI. Social Security does not count some property that you own. And use to support yourself as a resource. So this is another flexibility when counting, right? So that property can include property that you own and use in a trade or a business. Like a farm or gas station or that beauty parlor, the salon you were talking about. It also includes personal property that you use for work, such as all the equipment, the tools, the forms and uniforms. In the third area, on the list here is the government permits that allow you to do something to produce income. So if you have to get a lot of permits from the government for things like this example commercial fishing. Well the government would allow you, excuse me. The government would allow that to not be counted. So it's more financial flexibility. And this does get more technical. But something else that is good to know about PESS is that Social Security will not count as a resource for your business bank account. So keep money separate. And then the PESS could allow the bank account to be kept separate and not counted if you're on SSI. All right, the third one is Unincurred Business Expense. This is a non-monetary contribution that someone else makes to your self employment effort that you don't have to pay for. Social Security deducts the cost of the contribution from your earnings when they determine if you're engaging in Substantial Gainful Activity. Even though you didn't have to pay for it. So this is a great option. If this was self employment, if you have a volunteer that is providing some services, that money doesn't - those hours of time doesn't have to count. Or here your state, the agency might provide you with a computer to accomplish your tasks. The computer came at no cost. But would still be considered a business expense you had paid for. Even though there wasn't an actual expense. So Unincurred Business Expense is another way to kind of use all of the tools that are available, to reduce that financial amount. So if you're engaging in Substantial Gainful Activity, it changes the amount to allow you more time before you know, going over that threshold and losing the benefit. Had you paid for it, it would have been deducted anyways. That's how they kind of act like with this. And that lowers your earnings amount and allow you to stay below SGA longer. So another good Work Incentive and a flexible tool, you can talk to a service provider about that if that's going to be with your story, you know, self employment and that Work Incentive comes along. 
Before we turn to the next section we wanted to talk about working your network. So we have those free Work Incentives, and they're tools in your toolkit. But working your network as an entrepreneur is another great tool. So networking can give you the opportunity to find the mentors that we're talking about who can provide you that sounding board advice and guidance. And that could really help in starting on your path to you know, opening a business or you know potentially becoming a freelancer or an independent consultant. You can do that in person. You can do it virtually. Many of us are familiar with LinkedIn. The way to connect with individuals. If you're on LinkedIn and you want to join an entrepreneur group, there's plenty of them out there. You can find them in your community. Through a virtual group or you can find national ones as well. What we encourage you to do is to find someone who started doing what you want to do and get to know them and ask them the questions. You know what, a saying that I use a lot. One job can lead to another job. And I think one experience can lead to another one. So when I started on my path about 12 years ish ago, I started to realize the importance of networking. And I realize that we don't teach it very much. And so when I had my passion come around to designing a business, I wanted to make sure that it would provide as a core, networking and mentoring supports. So for the past eight years or so, a lot of our work is focused around teaching people how to network. And that includes young adults with intellectual disabilities. I couldn't have done that if I was working for somebody else, because it's hard to convince people of the value of that work. But I found people in several states around the country that recognize the value and built a networking capability as a networking training center or academy. And that's grown over time. And of course, you can use other things like LinkedIn and MeetUp groups. And they have ones for disabled entrepreneurs as well. There's a great one on Facebook called Diversibility. And if that's the type of thing that you like, then you could join that group and find some advisors and mentors that will listen and support. So in the last one, don't forget to reach out to your family or friends in that network. They always have great ideas. And some of them very well may be freelancers or independent consultants or business owners. So keep that in mind. They can help you as well. So we do have the Web Links pod number 22. A great list of websites that are freelancer sites. They can help you find work and you can kind of network through those. One of the larger ones, by the way just did in one year $3.8 billion of work through the freelancing model. So this is a significant way to find employment and that can be full time employment. 
Okay on the next slide, another great tool is SCORE. This is a network of volunteer business mentors. If you don't like the other examples I shared, consider SCORE. You could access a mentor at score.org. They have a lot of great workshops and educational resources out there as well. They have a business plan template for start up business. And they also have a great tool, I checked it out. It's a financial projection template. Remember that was my weak place, so whenever I see those tools are out there I like to look at them. I hope you can give SCORE a chance when the time is right. If you need those resources or if you want to find a mentor. 
All right, we like to share our success stories and this month we have Marty. We want to make sure that you're familiar with Marty's story. And - and we selected Marty because of his self employment story. Marty used the Ticket Program to stay in construction after losing a limb to cancer. Marty is on the screen here. He's a white male wearing dark clothes, with a brick wall behind him. He has his right arm and it's on his hip, but it's clear that in his short sleeve shirt he's lost his left arm. So important to note, before he had cancer and it's kind of interrupting his life. Marty was a self employed contractor, as a carpenter. And he specialized in building homes. When he was unable to work, he had to put that on pause, and he went on the benefits. And you know, through return to work when he was on SSDI, he was able to start working with a large building restoration company. And that led to him not receiving SSDI anymore. And you know through that experience, he was in New York State, and he had an Individual Work Plan. And he figured out how to get back to work. And then years later Marty returned to work for himself again. Which is so cool, because he's kind of back to the start after being a cancer survivor. And in this, he reflected “it's the creation of something from nothing that gives me satisfaction. Taking a pile of wood and turning it into a structure, an enduring part of someone's life is like building a legacy. That's what keeps me going.” So for Marty, his passion was in that piece of wood and creating something from nothing. That keeps him going. And perhaps it kept him going through his treatment and his return to work after cancer. So he's now self employed. Like he was before. And self employment was right for Marty and perhaps that will be the right choice for you too. All right, before we go to our next question break, I - session, we have some additional resources I just wanted to cover too. We mentioned businesses and the Small Business Administration. This group maintains and strengthens the nation's economy by aiding, counseling, assisting and protecting the interest of small businesses and by helping families and businesses recover from national disasters. They provide technical assistance to help entrepreneurs. They provide assistance in financing and contracting. And they provide a lot of information on laws and regulations. I visit their website frequently. I encourage you to check it out as well to learn more. We also have the Small Business Administration community navigators, this is a pilot program. Part of the American Rescue Plan designed to reduce barriers for under-represented and under-served entrepreneurs who are facing on with accessing the programs needed to recover, grow or start their business. So you can be guaranteed that they have these hubs. And they're around these areas of importance, finance, financial assistance and access to capital, contracting and procurement, marketing, operations, business development and exporting. And last and importantly industry specific training. So great resources from the SBA in general. And then some - one's related to the American Rescue Plan for under-represented and under-served entrepreneurs that we encourage you checking out. And Web Links pod number 24 there's a link to access to the community navigator’s information. Next, Disability:IN is a non-profit organization. They are for business - they focus on disability inclusion. One of the program areas that Disability:IN offers is a certification program for disability-owned business enterprises or DOBE's. They also support veteran disabled owned businesses and service disabled veteran owned disability owned businesses. I know it's a lot. But importantly they've linked these disability owned businesses to organizations including Fortune 1,000 companies who are looking to diversify their supply chains with minority owned businesses including women owned small businesses, LGBT owned small businesses and disability owned businesses. If you go the path of starting a business, I encourage you to know about this DOBE certification program. The key is the owner needs to have 51% of ownership and control of the organization. You could actually go into a mentor protégé program through this, and Disability:IN would assign you with a large business to help you and your start up and operating process. Okay, and the last resource we have is the Affordable Connectivity Program. This program is an important one, the ACP. It's an effort to help more households get access to broadband. The Affordable Connectivity Program from the Federal Communications Commission is a benefit program that helps ensure that households can afford the broadband they need for work, school, healthcare and more. The ACP provides eligible households with the discount on broadband service and connected devices. It also provides a discount of up to $30.00 per month toward the internet for eligible households and up to $75.00 per month for homes on qualifying tribal lands. This is really important information if you're looking to access the internet and access equipment to use the internet, here's some discounts that you might be eligible for if you want to find out if you're eligible please visit fcc.gov/acp this is also available in the Web Links pod at item number 26. And with that, we've come to our second Q & A. And I'll bring Pat back to find out what questions we have out there.

Pat >> Well you want to take a minute and have a drink of water?
Derek >> Thanks Pat.

Pat >> What I'm hearing and seeing is a few more questions and these are primarily about self employment. But there's one that has a tie-in to Social Security. The person says, I like the idea of self employment. But before I jump into starting my own business, I need to know what will happen to my healthcare?

Derek >> This is Derek. The idea of - likely potential loss of healthcare. So this is a question that we have a lot, whether it's self employment or standard employment. A lot of people do worry about that. I think the important thing to know is working does not necessarily mean losing access to healthcare benefits. Whether they're federal or state healthcare benefits. Because there are so many protections in place. Those protections are employment supports are these Work Incentives. And while we didn't cover all of them today, there are important ones out there that things like the Trial Work Period, and then this Extended Period of Eligibility. That could allow you to keep those healthcare benefits for years. Over five years. And with that, you know it's related to the Medicaid and Medicare services and supports that you have access to through those benefits. We do have a Medicare and Medicaid employment support factsheet available. And so if you're concerned about the transition to work and am I going to lose the healthcare benefits, thinking through those Work Incentives with that fact sheet in mind, is really important. So you can check out in the Web Links pod, item number 15. And what we want you to do is explore the Work Incentives around Medicare, Medicaid employment supports as well. So check that out. But it's an important question. We also have service providers that can talk to you about that. So if you want to explore that in more detail when you start to look for work or self employment you can access the benefits council or services to explore that in more detail.

Pat >> Thanks Derek. Speaking of Work Incentives, we have a question that if my sister is going to help me handle part of my business, like she's going to respond to customer emails, but I'm not paying her, is that a Work Incentive? Is that that Unincurred Business Expense?

Derek >> Thanks Pat, this is Derek again. Yes, it is the Unincurred Business Expense as I described. First it's great that you can have a family member that is willing to contribute without pay, to help you get going. I think that's fantastic. It absolutely does count as an Unincurred Business Expense. In a standard business model, we would be paying the sister. Therefore, it's unincurred because there is no pay. But you can capture that and that would reduce that financial income level, that they're looking for compared to Substantial Gainful Activity income. So it's a great thing to capture. And to keep her working for as long as you need to turn the corner as you ramp up the business. The same thing around that Unincurred Business Expense can happen as I mentioned before, around you know equipment, computers, things that you don't pay for but you get. And in this area, you know, Pat, entrepreneurship could mean recordkeeping. Starting a business and being a freelancer, you do have to keep more records than I ever imagined. So you know being self employed means recordkeeping. If you're going to do this, you have to capture the hours that your sister works, like a timesheet. So if somebody asked you to provide the evidence of the Unincurred Business Expense, you would have that ability to deliver. That's an Excel report or something. That type of thing. So definitely get advice on how to be organized, so recordkeeping wouldn't be an issue. It's a good question. A great Work Incentive available for people who are self employed.

Pat >> Yeah and I think that was a pretty good tip, about keeping track of how many hours your sister worked. I didn't even think about that. You know I think people might be interested in your own experience. Like maybe you could spend a couple minutes telling us what you like most about it. I know you've talked about some of it. Talked about the benefits of self employment, but what do you like most?

Derek >> Thanks Pat. I - yeah when I think about my journey as an entrepreneur, I think at the heart of it is I really care about what I am able to do for work. You know so in centering disability inclusion and employment at the heart of the business, it allowed me to center what I care most about. And it almost didn't become work. And for some folks you might hear this work/life balance. That is really important. But when in effect you're vocation and advocation, like what you do for work and just what you really enjoy doing become one, that's when it really started to - I hit stride. 
So you know looking through the transition from youth into the education system, into post secondary education into employment. That was really what I wanted to get involved with. And so when I had a chance to work with young adults, around topics that weren't getting much attention, I knew that I was never going to do anything again. You know, just yesterday I met with three young adults via Zoom who have intellectual disabilities that are attending a conference tomorrow in Sacramento, California. And I was able to put them to launch two new activity guides in plain language about finding a job. And about using community service to gain experience. And it's just so rewarding; so that's kind of number one that just drives me. And then I think the second area that I like, it's not like it's less important. But it has been important, I have more control over who I work with. And the people I work with you don't always get to control every element of it. But I really enjoy the people I work with. We - we look at work with a common approach for what we can do better. We can make a better world together. And I feel like I'm really fortunate to have that - the ability to have a little bit more control over you know, employees and in effect clients too. Sometimes we say we don't want to go after that, because it's not necessarily the type of project or people that we want to be partnered with. And you know, if there's time for a third, I'll say I commuted for 18 years. And you know one of the things I like now is I do work from home. After commuting for a year I calculated that I spent a year of my life commuting. And I'm lucky to have an opportunity where now I don't have to do that. So I think that's an important one for me. Because I lost a lot of time in the car and on a train.

Pat >> And by now Derek, you know I'm going to ask you what's next is what do you like least?

Derek >> Yeah. Well the recordkeeping part isn't my favorite thing, because I'm more of the people person. I mentioned accounting, the finance. I've gotten a little bit better at that. But I think the area that I have come to like the least is - is probably the intersection with all the regulations. Being a business owner, you want to spend time as an entrepreneur innovating and you know selling and learning and changing. But you have to spend a lot of your time balanced on the other side, the back office stuff. And I don't like that as much. But it is a time - it's a consumption of time. And I think over all that least part is balanced with I have a pretty good work ethic, and I acknowledge that my parents are the ones that instilled that in me. And so it's all got to get done. Let's get it done and then we'll get back to the stuff we enjoy more.

Pat >> How about when you got started or what - was there someone that particularly supported you when you started your business?
Derek >> Yeah, you know not a lot of people actually know this. But you know, I guess I'd say the first people that supported me was when I was young I learned about business through a program called Junior Achievement. I was in the Rochester, New York area. And I had many mentors from companies like Eastman Kodak and Bausch and Lomb and Xerox. They taught me how to run a business. And I did that for four years during high school. I went to a lot of national things. And learned about everything really, finance, marketing, sales from those folks. Years later when I was starting this company, I had somebody who was my mentor. Some of you may know her, Susan Daniels. She was a Deputy Commissioner at Social Security and then retired. And we were working together and I had monthly networking meetings with her. And during those meetings we started to figure out that her plans and my plans would really look better together, and that's when we decided to start the company that I currently have. So she helped position me with tough questions. She would say well why are we doing that? Or how are you going to get that to work? And so for me, she was an individual that had a unique impact on why we started this and what we're doing. Unfortunately she passed away a couple years after we started those networking meetings and I had to pause everything. And so now I have other mentors for areas like finance and accounting. Then I have a person that I do mentoring connections with and now most of the time after doing these for so many years, you know the sounding board advice is Derek why are you asking me? You already know the answer. And I think for some of us that's true. And I would recommend that you have mentors, but also to trust your instincts. Only you as the entrepreneur are going to have the core idea. So thank the people that have helped you on your journey to self employment and surround yourself with them. But stay true to yourself too, that's what makes you an entrepreneur.

Pat >> Thanks Derek. I think that's about all the time we have for questions. But you provided so much information about self employment. And a lot of insight from your own experience. I think you've given people a lot to think about if they want to go in that direction. So thank you.

Derek >> Thanks Pat.

Pat >> Speaking of directions. I just want to take a couple minutes to give you some pointers on how you can begin finding that right job for you. The self employment is deciding if it's right, you know? Talking to the program service providers. Derek already told you about the help line. But it's really an important resource. They have trained and certified specialists who can give you information about your personal situation. The kind of individual attention that we can't provide on a national webinar. So please take advantage of this resource and call them. That's 1-866-968-7842 or for the hearing impaired there's a TTY number at 1-866-833-2967. Both those lines are available Monday through Friday from 8:00 to 8:00 Eastern Time. 
I also highly recommend you take a look at our website at choosework.ssa.gov you'll find many more details there about the Ticket Program and self-employment. I did a quick search this morning before this webinar and found more than 20 articles of documents and even podcasts that specifically talked about self employment. In addition, the websites where you'll find our find help tool that you can use to locate service providers that can assist as you decide whether or not you want to move down the path of self employment and how work can effect your benefits. That's at choosework.ssa.gov/findhelp. 
If you'd like to learn more about these monthly webinars or catch our latest blogs, think about subscribing to our email updates. The link https://choosework.ssa.gov/contact will take you to a page where you can sign up. Or if you're more of a social media person, join us on Facebook. Another way to get information about the program is to opt in to receive text messages. Just text ticket to 1-571-489-5292. Standard messaging rates may apply. You can opt out at any time. 
Finally, you can always email us at support@choosework.ssa.gov. We'd like to have you join us for our next webinar, “Ticket to Work for America Veterans”. We'll have a special guest presenter who will talk about how VA benefits and Social Security Benefits interact. If you, or someone you know want to learn more about how work impacts benefits for veterans, be sure to mark your calendars for this one. Due to the Thanksgiving holiday the WISE will be a little earlier than usual. It will be on Wednesday, November 15 from 3:00 p.m. to 4:30 p.m. Eastern Time. And registration is now open at choosework.ssa.gov/wise. 
Finally, as much as we enjoy bringing you these webinars, they are really for you. If there is something you want to hear about or you have ideas for future webinar topics, let us know. You can provide your ideas or feedback by taking our survey. We do read them all. A link will pop up after the webinar, or you can find the survey in the Web Links pod or by visiting the Ticket Program website at choosework.ssa.gov/surveys/wise. I want to thank you for taking the time to be with us today. And for your great questions. I hope we can give you information that you will be able to use as you move forward on your own path. This concludes today's webinar.