Derek Shields >> Good afternoon and welcome, everyone, to today's Ticket to Work webinar: What is Ticket to Work? My name is Derek Shields, and I am the senior development and training manager for the Ticket Program Manager, and more importantly, I'll be serving as today's moderator. I have about 30 years of experience in disability services and serve as president of ForwardWorks Consulting and also as an advisory council co-chair for the National Disability Mentoring Coalition. I'm very excited that you've decided to join us for today's webinar. We'll be covering, obviously, what is the Ticket to Work program along with the services and supports that come from the Employment Team members. But before we dive into the details of this webinar, let's cover some logistics so everyone can have a successful experience. 

First, please know that all attendees will be muted throughout today's webinar. When asked, “how do you want to join the meeting's audio?” please select the system default option. This will enable the sound to be broadcast through your computer. Make sure your speakers are turned on or your headphones are fully plugged in to access the sound. If you do not have sound capabilities on your computer or prefer to listen by telephone, please select the Connect with Phone Audio button on the previous slide and the dial in option. Dial 1-800-832-0736 and then enter the access code 4189148#. You can also use the Join the Meeting Audio via Receive a Phone Call as shown in the image on the screen and enter the same number and access code. 

Now let's review the Adobe Connect platform. First, you will notice different boxes on your screen. These boxes are called pods. We have the presentation pod, and this is where the slide deck appears. That's the largest portion of the screen. Below that is an open space for the placement of your closed captioning pod. We have that blue arrow pointing to that. The top-right corner is the Q&A pod, and below that is the Web Links pod. We'll talk about all these pods in more detail shortly, but first we want to mention accessibility. 

Real-time captioning is available and is displayed in the captioning pod. You can place that below the slides. You can show or hide the captioning display and can also choose the text size and text color combination to best meet your vision preferences. To open closed captioning, please select the CC option that's at the top menu bar. The captioning link can also be accessed in the Web Links pod under the title Web Captioning. You can also access captioning online in a separate viewing window. That choice is really up to you and whatever your personal preferences are. 

If you are fluent in American Sign Language and would like support during today's webinar, we developed a resource that provides instructions on how to connect with an interpreter through the Federal Communications Commission Video Relay Service. The ASL User Guide can be found in the bottom right corner in the Web Links pod. That is at item 5. Just select that to get more information on the ASL User Guide. We are here today to answer your questions. We know that you have a lot of questions that you can develop during the session about the Ticket program. Please send your questions to us anytime throughout the webinar by typing them in the upper-right area of the Q&A pod. We will then direct these questions to our presenter today during two Q&A portions. So please send us your questions. Our team is ready to answer. We do want to remind you that we are not allowed to answer personal questions, so please keep your questions general in nature. And of course, please do not put any personally identifiable information in the Q&A. We want to protect that PII. But if you have some general questions, please share those. And if you're listening by phone and not able to use the Q&A pod in the webinar platform, you may ask us questions by emailing us at ttwwebinars@ssa.gov. Our team is standing by to respond. 

Another available resource that we think you will find very useful is the Web Links pod. This pod is in the bottom right of your screen, as I just pointed to for the ASL User Guide and lists the links of the resources covered in the webinar. To access the resources, please select the topic of interest and go directly to that. We of course encourage you to open it up but also still pay attention along the way. If you're listening by phone and not logged into the webinar, you may email us again at ttwwebinars@ssa.gov for a list of available resources, or you may reference your confirmation email that you received for today's webinar to access the presentation and other resources. Also, please note that Social Security cannot guarantee and is not responsible for the accessibility of external websites. Now, we do hope that everyone has a great experience during the webinar. However, if you experience any technical difficulties, we encourage you to tell us through the Q&A pod, to send us a message, or again, you can email us at ttwwebinars@ssa.gov. 

I'd like again to take a moment to welcome you to today's webinar: What is Ticket to Work? My name is Derek Shields, and I'll serve as our moderator, and I'm now happy to introduce our presenter, Ray Cebula. Ray received his law degree from the University of New Hampshire's Franklin Pierce School of Law. He spent 23 years providing legal services to individuals with disabilities and their interactions with Social Security and then became part of Cornell University's Work Incentive Support Center. And in 2005, Ray joined the staff of Cornell's Yang Yang-Tan Institute on Employment and Disability. He now serves as the program director of YTI Online. That is Cornell's Work Incentives Practitioner Credentialing Program. Ray, welcome back to the WISE webinar. Ray? There you go. Coming off of mute. 

Ray Cebula >> Thank you, Derek. It's good to be with you today. All right, today's webinar overview, we're going to discuss Social Security's Ticket to Work Program, or the Ticket Program, as we call it for short. And how can it help you answer questions like, What is this program, the Ticket to Work Program? Can I work and keep my Social Security disability benefits? Can I work and keep my healthcare, whether that is Medicare or Medicaid, and who can help me achieve my work goals? 

So what is Social Security's Ticket to Work Program? Yeah, the Social Security Administration administers two disability benefits programs, and we'd like to tell you all what they are, in brief, but let you know that it's very important that who you're working with, who your Employment Team who have made up of needs to know which benefit you have. So it's a good idea to figure that out as soon as you possibly can. One of those programs is Social Security Disability Insurance, or SSDI. It is exactly what it says it is. It's an insurance program. It's for people who have worked and have worked long enough to become insured. And these people become basically insured for an income replacement if they become disabled. SSI, on the other hand, Supplemental Security Income, is a needs-based program. It's also paid to people who have disabilities, who are aged or are blind. This program is needs based again. It does not require a work history, so that somebody who has worked a bit and has not become insured for SSDI could still be eligible for SSI, as well as somebody who hasn't yet worked. Two very different programs. We're going to talk about the Ticket. We're going to talk about a lot of Work Incentives, and when we get to those Work Incentives, it's important to know that there is one set for each of those benefits, which is why we need to know what that benefit is, that you receive. 

What is the Ticket to Work Program? The Ticket to Work Program is a free and voluntary Social Security program. Remember, free and voluntary. You choose to participate when you are ready to, if you want to, and there is no cost to you along the way. The program offers career development for people aged 18 through 64 who receive a Social Security disability benefit and want to work for the first time or return to the workforce. How can the Ticket Program help? The Ticket to Work Program connects you with free services to help you decide if work is right for you, prepare for work once you've decided which type of work you want to begin, and find a paid work opportunity. Derek mentioned his mentoring program, and, you know, mentoring is a great help to everybody, and these paid work experiences that can result from some of that process are also exceptional opportunities. And lastly, to succeed at work, we don't want to get you a job and place you in employment and say goodbye. We want to be able to work with you so that when you hit a speed bump, you know, when you hit the curbstone, we are going to be there to help you. And once you are set, once you feel you're good to go, then we will stop working with you, if that is your choice. But we want you to be placed in employment, and we want you to be succeeding. You can learn more about these at What is Social Security's Ticket to Work Program? in the Web Links, and also, there's a self-guided tutorial there to begin exploring. 

The Ticket to Work Help Line is a great place to start. There are lots of questions you may have, and the Ticket to Work Help Line can help you answer them or at least get you to someone who can give you a more detailed answer, should you need that. They offer a toll-free Help Line to answer your questions and support you on your journey to financial independence. Call the Ticket to Work Help Line Monday through Friday, 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. Eastern Time. The number is 1-866-968-7842. And for TTY users, it's 1-866-833-2967. 

So our first topic today is can I work and keep my Social Security disability benefits? Short answer is yes. Now let's figure out what that means. Lots of Work Incentives, and I mentioned them earlier. Again, one set of Work Incentives applies to SSDI. One set of Work Incentives applies to SSI. So Social Security has safety nets in place, and we call them Work Incentives that allow you to keep all of your benefits or some of your benefits while you begin working. Work Incentives are programs and rules that help a beneficiary enter or re-enter or continue employment by protecting their eligibility for benefits payments and or healthcare until they can replace their SSDI or SSI benefits with earnings from employment or self-employment according to Social Security standards. Now, there's a lot of stuff built in there, but we will be talking about a lot of it. Whether you're looking for a job for the first time or returning to work after an injury or illness, Work Incentives can help you through the transition to work and towards financial independence. That's a really good thing. You know, in the ideal situation, the people on your Employment Team will be helping you make that easy transfer from benefits to financial independence via earned income. So the first Work Incentive, and this is an SSDI Work Incentive, is the Trial Work Period. You know, this is one of the many incentives available to people, again, who receive SSDI, the insurance program. If you receive SSDI, the Trial Work Period, or TWP, allows you to test your ability to work for at least nine months. You know, during your Trial Work Period, you'll receive your full SSDI benefits no matter how much you earn, as long as you report the work activity and continue to meet Social Security's rules for disability. So remember here, there's a difference between earnings impacting your benefits and your disability status impacting those benefits. 

How do we calculate a Trial Work Period? The TWP continues until you accumulate nine service months. They're not necessarily consecutive, but they have to fall in a five-year period. Now, that's confusing, so I'm going to give you a little sample here. If I return to work in January of 2025 and earn more than $1,160 in gross wages, I have used a trial work month. Every month I'll be reporting my gross wages to Social Security. If they are above $1,160 in a month, I have used a trial work month. If they're not, I have not used a trial work month. And we count, you know, every month you use a Trial Work Period, we go back and count. Are there nine of them in a five-year period? So once you do it a few times, you know, just imagine yourself working with five years in a row and mark them off as you're going. You will see how we can accumulate those. So there's also another rule for people who are self-employed because we all know that if you start a business today, you may work real hard, but you may not earn any money, right? Small businesses take time to begin earning a profit. If you work more than 80 hours in one month, you will also have used a trial work month because that more than 80-hour month is considered a service month. So two different standards: one for people who are working for somebody else and one for people who are working for themselves. 

Now, how can you get more information? Take a look at the Trial Work Period fact sheet in the Web Links pod to learn more about the Trial Work Period and about another Work Incentive that's available when you complete your Trial Work Period called the Extended Period of Eligibility. Now, the Extended Period of Eligibility, just so you'll have a little bit of information on that, is a 36-month period — three years' consecutive months, 36 of them — while you're still protected, and we look at a different number. Just remember that it begins the month immediately after the Trial Work Period. So again, check your Web Links pod. Again, with questions, call the  Help Line. 

Now, what is a Plan to Achieve Self Support? A Plan to Achieve Self Support, or PASS plan, is a Work Incentive for SSI recipients. Yeah. We're looking to gain funds to pursue a specific work-related goal. The PASS plan describes the steps that you will take and the items of services you will need to reach that goal. For instance, if I want to become a teacher, a teaching assistant — let's do that one — I'm going to need to apply to a community college to get a two-year degree in teaching assistants. I'm going to have to find money to pay that. I could be saving in my past to pay tuition. I could be applying for grants. I could be applying for scholarships. When we finish school, you know, I'm going to need, you know, a car. I need a car to go to work. You know, notice I'm not becoming a car. I'm becoming a teaching assistant who needs a car to go to work. I have to get some clothes for my interview. You know, I need to have somebody, you know, the assist — if you're not participating in the Ticket to Work, I might need somebody to help me find a placement, give me some interview skills. All of that can be put into the plan and much more. When you have an approved PASS, Social Security does not count the money you set aside to help reach your goal when you're determining your SSI payment amount. Normally, a person can have $2,000 if they're single, $3,000 if they are married, and that resource limit can be exceeded by putting money into a PASS plan that will not — that you will use to achieve that goal and will not count as a resource for SSI purposes. 

Who is eligible for a PASS? If you receive SSI or can become eligible to receive SSI, you can be eligible for a PASS. If you're to receive SSDI, you might be eligible for a PASS. If you have a work goal that will allow you to work enough and earn enough income so that you will no longer qualify for SSI, that's the goal of your vocational goal with a PASS plan. If you're on SSDI, you will earn enough money so that you will no longer qualify for benefits. You would need to meet all of the other qualifications for a PASS and set aside enough of your SSDI payment so that you can become eligible for SSI. Now, that also might be a bit confusing, and there are steps that need to be taken. And benefits planners, an Employment Network can help you. Those are members of your Employment Team. They can help you take those steps in the proper order so that you're not going to risk any potholes or curbstones on your way to get that PASS. 

Now very important is health care. You know, in my experience with benefits planning and helping people return to work, the bigger question is the loss of health care. People aren't worried about the cash payment because they know they'll have more if they succeed in returning to work or starting work for the first time, but they are very, very concerned about their Medicaid or Medicare benefits. So how will work affect my Medicaid or Medicare benefits? If you receive SSDI benefits or SSI payments of any amount while you are working, you will keep your Medicaid or Medicare. That's the bottom line. You know, if you are still eligible for Social Security disability payment, you will still have your health care. If your benefits payment stop due to earnings from work, including self-employment, in many cases, you may be able to keep Medicaid or Medicare indefinitely by using some of the Work Incentives we'll talk about and then the Medicaid Buy-In program that's available now, I think, in 48 of the 50 states, a fabulous program. It really changed the world for people who are trying to return to work. 

So Work Incentives and programs to help you keep Medicare and Medicaid. If we look at the Medicaid box, Medicaid while working, it's a program that we call 1619(b), which allows you to keep your Medicaid if your earnings zero out your SSI cash benefits. So you will be eligible for $0 in SSI. You'll still be considered a recipient. All of this has to happen because of earned income, and you can continue to increase your earnings up to your state threshold. And then the Medicaid Buy-In program. So even after you work yourself out of 1619(b) Medicaid coverage, you can participate in your buy-ins, and those buy-ins have, you know, many, many of the buy-ins will cover you up to $100,000 a year and beyond, and they're wonderful programs. 

Now let's switch gears for the SSDI recipient. If you're a Medicare recipient, it comes along with your SSDI, you have the extended period of Medicare coverage. We talked about the Trial Work Period. Your extended period of Medicare coverage is at least 93 months after the end of your Trial Work Period. That's like seven and 2/3 of a year, almost eight years. That's a long time, you know, and people will talk to you. You know, the benefits planners can talk to you about when that period might start and when it might end. But seriously, if you have seven and a half years, seven and 2/3 of a year to work without worrying about it, focus on your return to work. Focus on becoming a worker because you really don't have anything to worry about. And then after that, we have Medicare for people with disabilities who work. This is going to depend upon you paying premiums, and all you need to do is remain disabled. Your Social Security has not reviewed your case and told you that you are no longer disabled according to the Social Security standard. If that happens, all bets are off, right? But if it doesn't happen, and you continue to work, you can continue to pay for these benefits as long as you need them. You know, once you turn 65, you become eligible on the basis of age, and then there's no worry at all. So this is a very, very fine program, and you notice both Medicare and Medicaid can continue for years and years after you begin working. At some point, both of them are going to end up in a premium-based program, and people will talk to you about those premiums, how much they are and how you might get some help to meet the needs. 

On the Medicaid side, the premiums are very negligible. So Medicaid while working or 1619(b). If you receive SSI, you may qualify for Medicaid coverage when your payments stop due to earnings if you have been eligible for SSI for at least one month. That's easy enough. Continue to meet Social Security's definition of disability. Still meet all of the other non-disability SSI requirements. So that's that resource level we talked about. The one issue that I have with this program is that you can be earning a lot of money, but you need to spend it all, you know, because you — remember the $2,000 limit for an individual, $3,000 for a married couple. You know, but there are protected savings accounts that we can establish and help you get in order to put some of that money aside. Need Medicaid benefits to continue work? That's a requirement. Do you need your benefits to continue to work? And we have to realize that Medicaid is very expansive. It's a good program and that it may very well be providing you with the very supports that you need to continue working. And a lot of times when you're offered a private plan from your new employer, some of those benefits that Medicaid provide will not be covered. So you can keep both your employer-provided plan and Medicaid. And again, you have to have income, gross income, that's below your state threshold, and there's an updated threshold amount chart at ssa.gov/disabilityresearch/wi/1619b.htm. That's probably in your Web Links pod as well. 

Now, the Medicaid Buy-In program, I told you this was a game-changer, and it really, really was. Many states are going to allow you to purchase Medicaid under a buy-in program. You may qualify if you meet the definition of disabled under the Social Security Act. So notice that. You don't need to be on benefits. You just need to meet the definition of disability. Each state's program is very different, and I can't begin to tell you how different they are, but most require that you have some earnings from work. You know, the one in New York is called the Medicaid Buy-In for Working People with Disabilities. So there's work. If you think of Work Incentives, you can only get them by working. Some states allow you to have significant earnings from work or self-employment and greater savings than Medicaid normally allows. You know, we're going to look at New York again because that's the one I'm most familiar with. You know, the New York program will allow you to earn $79,000 or $80,000, yeah, and it has a $20,000 resource limit, so you can save some of that money that you're earning. You know, under certain circumstances, people who receive SSDI benefit may also be eligible for the buy-in program. That's a great thing too, you know, because you may need, again, these Medicaid services to continue your work effort. And even on SSDI, we could purchase those through the Medicaid program. Again, it's a buy-in. There is a premium. It's usually based on income. And again, it is very — they're all very reasonable. You know, I haven't seen one that, you know, made me gasp at all. You should check with your local Medicaid agency to find out what is available in your state. And everybody assumes this is Medicaid. Well, Medicaid is made up of very different plans. So we want to check with your state program in order to determine what options you have in New York or in New Mexico or in California. 

Now, the extended period of Medicare coverage, this is the SSDI program we've been talking about. You know, most SSDI beneficiaries whose benefit payments stop due to work will continue to receive after their Trial Work Period, at least 93 consecutive months of hospital insurance Part A. That is premium free. Supplemental medical insurance, Part B, if you're enrolled. You know, that is also something that requires a premium, and you should speak to people about it, whether the not enrolling could present problems in the future. So make sure you enroll in a timely basis. And premium drug coverage, Part D, if you're enrolled. Again, Part D requires a premium. The average premium this year is about $4,250, I believe, and you can get plans from $0 up to $80 to meet those prescription drug needs. And we're not going to talk about it today, but there are help programs that can help pay those premiums or help you pay some of those premiums. They are income based. And remember, this is a Work Incentive. You need to be working to get it. Medicare for people with disabilities who work. You know, after your premium-free Medicare coverage ends because of work, you can buy continued Medicare coverage as long as you remain disabled, and that's disabled according to Social Security standard. You are eligible to buy Medicare coverage if you are not yet 65 because, at 65, you become aged, and you are eligible on the basis of age, and you continue to have a disabling impairment, and your Medicare stopped due to earnings from work, again, a Work Incentive. We need to have work activity to get these extra periods of time. If you have Medicare questions, for more information, please visit medicare.gov. It's actually a very friendly website. You can chat or talk with somebody live, 24 hours a day, seven days a week, at 1-800-MEDICARE or 1-800-633-4227 or, for TTY users, 1-877-486-2848, and humans pick up those phones, and a human will talk to you. It's also a very helpful and friendly phone line. Okay, Derek, that brings us to our first break for questions. 

Derek >> This is Derek. Ray, thank you so much for going through all the content. I'm sure, as we've seen in the comments in the Q&A pod, that this — there's a lot of details, and it, at times, might feel overwhelming for folks that are exploring all this. One of the things I just like to encourage folks to know is that there are a lot of available resources and tools to help in following up to your questions and supporting you. The very first item, we had a question says, well, where's the website for this? And we'll give it to you a couple times. But in the Web Links pod 3, the Choose Work — Ticket to Work link, that will take you to the Choose Work website. And we encourage you to visit the Choose Work website to follow up everything that Ray is saying today. It will help you walk through at your own pace. And we'll also repeat that beneficiary Help Line telephone number a couple more times too. With that said, Ray, you know that we have plenty of questions coming in, some generic and then others coming right to some of the Work Incentives that you were just talking about. Let's start out with a couple of the more basic ones. Do I need to use this program to find work? Or can I apply for jobs directly? 

Ray >> That's a good question, Derek. You know, as I said earlier, the Ticket to Work Program is voluntary. You do not need to use it to return to work. You can return to work on your own. Again, that Choose Work website will give you an overview of the Work Incentives that you can still use even if you don't want to use your Ticket. You know, the benefit of using your Ticket is the Employment Team, and we're going to talk a little bit about that in the next couple of slides, but that Employment Team is going to help you get through all of this dense material. Benefits planners can help you determine what will happen to your benefits as you earn income and net income increases. Employment Networks are out there to help you locate people in your — or businesses in your area who are hiring people and, you know, can determine — help you determine, just by talking with you, you know, what type of job do you want, and are you ready to begin pursuing employment? So there are benefits to the Ticket to Work, but, no, you can go to work on your own. So if you do that and apply for a job and get it, please remember that that needs to be reported to Social Security. And you need to report who the employer is, where they're located, how much you're expecting to earn, what your hourly rate might be, things like that, so that Social Security will be ready to receive your monthly reports of earned income. 

Derek >> This is Derek. Thanks, Ray, for that. It sounds like while you have the flexibility to make that choice on your own, there's a lot of benefits to working with the Employment Team, and we look forward to hearing more about those entities and their roles a little later. While this question has come in many forms that it's basically there's a lot of folks out there that are indicating their personal situations put constraints on the amount of time that they can work. Maybe they're a caregiver. Maybe they're going to school. A lot of different situations. This leads to the general question, is Ticket to Work for full-time employment, or is it possible to work part time? 

Ray >> It's very possible to work part time. And you know, there are certain income levels that are going to work with you using your Ticket, and you might be able — it really depends on what state you're in right now and even the locality and the state where the minimum wage is going up so much it's becoming more and more possible to work part time and meet the financial goals that you would need to use your Ticket to Work. If you're doing this yourself, you don't have to pay attention to those financial goals, and you can work as much or as little as you want. Again, if you do it on your own and even if you are using the Ticket, you need to report your return to work. You need to report your wages every month, and that way Social Security is keeping up with you so that your benefits are being paid properly. 

Derek >> Thanks, Ray. This is Derek again. Early on in the webinar, you brought up Ticket Program eligibility. Can you remind us of the ages, and is it possible for somebody to use the Ticket Program over the age of 64? 

Ray >> Yeah, it is, right now, for people between the ages of 18 — and that 18-year-old needs to be determined to be a disabled adult. So there's an extra step for that 18-year-old — through the ages of 64. Right now the Ticket stops. There has been a lot of discussion about increasing that. You know, the retirement age is increasing, so why not increase it to 67? And it hasn't gone anywhere yet, but once you are 65 years old, there is no Ticket that's available to you. 

Derek >> Thanks, Ray. Let's switch gears a little bit. You've talked a little bit about the Trial Work Period, and you talked about the PASS plan. And then we got into accessing Medicaid and Medicare while working. Let's go back to the Trial Work Period. There's been a lot of questions that basically are around the point of how many times can I start and stop during the Trial Work Period? So could you go through that a little bit more so those folks that heard it for the first time will have a little bit more confidence in how they could use the Trial Work Period? 

Ray >> Sure, I'm going to give it a good shot, anyway. You know, you — the way I like to think of it is your Trial Work Period begins the first time you earn more than $1,160 — that's 2025 figure — in a month. So your trial work always starts, right? Now the question is does it ever end? Remember, we talked about nine non-consecutive months within a five-year period. If you're working during the holidays, and you're only working in December and earning $2,000 a month, you are using a trial work month, a service month, because it's over $1,160, but will you have nine months in a five-year period? You won't because you're only working in December, so you only have five. So your Trial Work Period is going to continue until you capture nine within a five-year period, you know, which means if you want to work both December and January earning $2,000, you will catch those nine months in a 60-month period. Now, that 60-month period is important because, you know, if we're working just December, after five years, some of those months start falling off, you know? And the question is, do you have nine service months in a five-year period? Once you have collected nine in a five-year period, your Ticket to Work ends. That's when that Extended Period of Eligibility begins. So it can begin and never end if you're not working enough, or it can begin and end. And once it's ended, it is gone. It can't be restarted but for an exception that's way out in the future called Expedited Reinstatement. So generally, one Trial Work Period per period of disability. I hope that helps. 

Derek >> This is Derek. And it's really helpful. Ray, I got a follow-up to that. I've heard you say this before, and it's — I think it's an important piece of advice. When we talk about trying work, what's your recommendations for folks? You know, the example of working only in December, you know, this idea of what is somebody's capacity to work? What do you recommend for folks in that regard? 

Ray >> You know, that Trial Work Period is critical. I really believe those nine months are very critical because you are able to start a job and switch to another job. You know, you are able to start at 20 hours a week and work your way up to 30 hours a week. You know, you can use those nine months to determine what you want to do and what your capacity for work is. You know, so I like people to experiment by keeping income below the Trial Work Period. You know, if you have no idea what you want to do, and you decide that McDonald's is hiring, and you want to hire — you want to get a job, and you work at McDonald's and hate it, you know, switch to another job, you know? And if you're working with an Employment Network, they'll help you narrow that job down. When you find the job you want and, you know, have determined whether you can work 15, 20, 40, hours a week, then go for broke, you know, because remember the Trial Work Period, those nine months, you can earn $5,000 a month and still get your full check. You know, so you shouldn't be limited by that $1,160 figure. That just says you used one. But did you work to your maximum capacity, or are you using them while you're trying to figure it out? I think protect those months until you're ready to go for broke. 

Derek >> Thanks, Ray. This is Derek again. I appreciate that advice. Let's switch over now to talk a little bit about the PASS plan. We've had a few questions, not necessarily just about PASS, but about savings, like the need to save, and what kind of opportunities are there for Ticket Program participants to also be saving? So starting with PASS, you mentioned saving and assets limits that will impact SSI eligibility. Tell us what those limits are again, and then we'll dig into a little bit more on PASS and savings. 

Ray >> Okay, currently, an individual can have $2,000 in countable resources. So if I have $1,999 in my checking account, I'm good. If I have $2,000 I'm good. But if I have $2,001, I will lose my SSI benefits, you know, for that month. So there are, you know, and that figure for a married couple would be $3,000. They're pretty low. You know, they're very low. There are other accounts out there, the ABLE account, A Better Life Experience account, where you can save $19,000 a year. That's this year's figure. It usually goes up a bit every year, and it won't count towards your SSI. You know, it's protected. It can be used for just about anything. You know, it is sort of like a trust account because you need to make specific types of purchases. That could include food. That can include rent. Yeah, so it's pretty wide open, but that's one way to save some money. The other way to save money, if you're up and you are interested, if your earnings have pushed you up into the place where you're getting a Medicaid buy-in, you know, the resource levels are generally higher. You don't have cash SSI at that point, so we're not worried about that. But you do have too much, you know, for Medicaid. That's because the buy-in program, one of those Medicaid programs in your state, expanded it to allow people to save. That's exactly why they did this. If you're earning $60,000, $70,000 you may want to save some money. You're saving up for a new car, you know, or a gently used car. You know, that takes the ability to save a good amount of money. And with those different programs, you can. Again, those options will be presented to you by a benefits planner or by your EN, your Employment Network, if you are using the Ticket when you get started, so that you're aware that this is a possibility. 

Derek >> Thanks, Ray. You know, somebody asked in the Q&A pod about the limitations of savings, and you're explaining some good flexibilities. I just want to make note that on January 1 of 2026, the ABLE account program that Ray was talking about is going to change to disability onset before the age of 46. So if you're — if you're interpreting ABLE accounts today, it's currently before the age of 26. But that, on January 1, 2026, will change to onset of disability before the age of 46, so up to the age of 45. So consider that when you're thinking about savings and ABLE and PASS. All right, another question, Ray, for you, how detailed does my PASS budget need to be? 

Ray >> Very detailed. You can consider that PASS account as a savings and a spending account. Whoops. Derek, can you hear me? 

Derek >> Yes, yep, you're coming through clean. 

Ray >> Oh, you can, okay. Everything went blank for a minute. I'm with you, good. So you can consider that PASS plan a savings and spending account, and both have to be very detailed. If I am going to put $300 a month into the PASS account, I have to do that. Social Security will monitor that. They'll look at six months, 12 months, 18 months to determine if you're meeting your savings goals. Spending is also the same, you know, and I used going to school to become a teaching assistant. I'm going to use some of that money to apply. The applications may cost some money. I'm going to use some of that money for my deposit when a school accepts me, and then I will pay my first semester's tuition. I will buy my second semester's tuition. If I'm going to work during the summer, I might want to save more, so that's going to be detailed. When I get out, you know, I need a laptop for — to go to school. I'm going to buy that early, but it's going to tell me what brand, what type, what programs are going to be on that computer so that I can get through school. So it is a very, very detailed plan. 

Derek >> Thanks, Ray, appreciate that. That response question, it's come in a couple different forms, but the folks are asking about, well, if I'm in this state, or if I move from one state to another, how does the Ticket Program work? Do I have to change my provider in those states? Can you explain a little bit about how the national program works so folks have a little bit more clarity? 

Ray >> Sure. You know, the Employment Networks, you know, are private or state entities that have an agreement with Social Security to provide you with services, and some of them are tiny. You know, if I had — if I set up Ray's job shop, I may only decide to serve Santa Fe, New Mexico. You know, it's just me. There are others that cover the country or regions of the country. Some of them are getting bigger and bigger all the time. So if I have an EN when I am in New York, if that EN is national, it's possible that I could not only keep the same EN, but the same counselor, right, the same person that I've been working with. You can do everything via distance, you know, so that my move might just require, you know, a computer and an internet connection to keep in touch. Yeah, if you're working with Ray's job shop, and you move from Santa Fe to Phoenix, you would have to find somebody in Phoenix who would take over your plan. And there are ways that can happen. There are rules built in associated with changing ENs. You know, the benefits planners, you know, they're a little different, you know, because they are funded by states, yeah, and a couple of them — not many — but a couple of them do cover more than one state. Check with them because if not, you would then be transferring your entire benefits planning case to a new person in your new state. So there are some transitions that might have to be made. You know, again, once you're out of the area that the benefits planners cover, you're going to need to find somebody else. And I think that's all. 

Derek >> This is Derek. Ray, that's really helpful. It's basically, it's not a one-approach system. There are some flexibilities in it, and that's important for folks to know. They can make a choice. Speaking of that, I know in this next segment you're going to get into who can help you achieve your work goals and get into more details about what all these providers can do for folks. So why don't we give this back to you, and I'll be back with you for our second Q&A in a little bit? 

Ray >> Thank you, Derek. So who can help you achieve your work goals? Yeah, this is, you know, one of those times where I have to think back a little bit in history and say Hillary was right. It takes a village, and it does. It takes a village to raise a kid. It takes a village to help someone return to work or start work for the bet — for the first time. And we've got your villagers, you know, achieving your work goals with the Ticket to Work. As you think about returning to work and possibly changing jobs or careers, you may have questions and need support, particularly because you are a benefits recipient. What is going to happen? You know, what's going to happen to cash benefits? What's going to happen to health care? What do I do if I need a reasonable accommodation? How do I have that discussion? So connecting with a Ticket Program service provider can help you develop achievable work goals and establish steps to find and maintain employment in your new career. Notice that's what we hope for everybody. Using the word career there wasn't just a mistake or a happenstance. We picked that word because that's what we want. We want you to find a job and turn that job into your career. Ticket Program service providers can help you identify the type of job or career you might enjoy and any transferable skills you might have. You know, a transferable skill is what can you do despite your disability? Does your past work allow you to take some of those skills with you, despite your disability, and use them for something else? You know, I've turned 65. Social Security says I don't have any transferable skills because of my age. I'm just aged, you know? And I always have a good time laughing about that one, but that's what it is. Okay? 

The Ticket Program service providers, who are they? Through the Ticket Program, you'll have access to a variety of providers. You pick and choose who and what type of providers will be part of your team, and they are the Employment Networks we've mentioned, ENs and the state VR agency, you know, VR. You know, either one of them are going to be give — to be able to help you get placed in a job, you know, and support that effort in different ways. The Employment Networks. Again, an Employment Network is a private or public organization that has an agreement with Social Security to provide you with free employment support services if you have your Ticket to Work. Now, again, aged 18, provided you are a disabled adult through age 64. You don't need a paper Ticket. You can get one if you want by calling the Help Line. But the first thing the Employment Network is going to want to do is figure out if you have one. They have their ways. They have their contacts within Social Security to find out if your Ticket is available. Many state public workforce systems, such as the American Job Centers — used to be called One Stops — are workforce ENs. They're being designated by WF, and that's a great place to start. If you don't know who to contact, if you don't — I'm getting a little confused with the messages coming across my computer. If you don't — 

Derek >> Hey, Ray, this is Derek. Just to interrupt, sorry for that. Please continue. Everything's still going. 

Ray >> Okay, great. Thank you, Derek. Those workforce ENs, or One-Stop Shops, or American Job Centers, are great places. You know, if you've just been laid off, you can go in and apply for benefits there. You can immediately search for a new job, help get your resume put into place. Lots of great services that you can get there. And it's a great place just to go with no obligation to search what types of industries are in your area to see if there's one of those places where you might want to work. So never underestimate those American Job Centers. 

How can working with an EN help? Well, the services it supports are designed to help you on the path to financial independence through work, and they include identifying your work goals. I've had many a person tell me they don't know what they can do. I don't know what I can do. Well, you have skills. We just have to hone some of them, or you have to realize that some of the things you've been doing while you were disability — on disability developed skills, you know, that can be sold. How about writing and reviewing your resume? My last resume was prepared 25 years ago. I would need a lot of help to prepare a new one. They're different now. How about interview preparations? Interviewing is seriously a skill that you're going to need to develop. What kinds of questions are you expected to be asked? Do you have questions for your prospective employer? If I'm going to go down — I'm trying to think of a business that's here — Hilton Hotels. If I'm going to go to Hilton Hotels and sit for an interview, they're going to ask me, do you have questions for us? And you really need to do a little research, and maybe there is a program at that hotel for people with disabilities. Ask a question about it. Note that you were interested in that program because of your own situation. Let them know you're as interested in them as they should be with you. So preparing practice interviews are critical. I really believe that's absolutely critical. 

How about those reasonable accommodations? Remember that you don't have to ask for them during your interview. You need to ask for them when you begin working. You know, do you know what that accommodation is? Do you have any idea how much it costs? You know, we can — the Employment Networks can most certainly help you with that. The Job Accommodations Network, JAN, is a great place to find out that information because most reasonable accommodations are much cheaper than the employer is going to expect them to be. You know, in receiving benefits counseling, you know, many Employment Networks now have benefits planners on staff. If they don't, you can find them on Choose Work, the Choose Work site, that Derek pointed out, and the Find Help Tool. You know, benefits planning, I think, is critical as well because I want to know what's going to happen to my benefits the first month I work. You know, what should happen to those benefits? Yeah, I want to know what happens when I reach a certain earnings threshold. What will happen? Will my health insurance continue? You know, so it's better to be prepared for those events. You know, you will lose your cash benefits at this level of income, but remember, we can buy into Medicaid. We have 1619(b). We can actually pay premiums for Medicare to keep everything in place. You know, it's a great plan that will guide you through and make sure that transition from benefits to employment is easy for you. 

State VR agencies, these are big, big agencies, and they provide a wide variety of services to people with disabilities who return to work, enter work for the first time, or want to change their jobs. A state VR agency may offer benefits counseling as well, and you may also — and may also be able to help you with vocational rehabilitation and training and education. Now, as I said, the Employment Networks are all different sizes. Not many of them are going to be available to you for vocational rehabilitation. It's a very expensive service, so we might be using the state VR agency for that and then waiting. And once we're rehabilitated, sign up with a vocation — with an EN, an Employment Network, to guide us into the workplace or training or education. You know, Ray's job shop here in Santa Fe is not going to be able to pay your tuition for four years at the University of New Mexico. The state rehabilitation agency might do that, you know, so we can use both in certain circumstances to get what we need to return to work. State vocational rehabilitation normally has enough funding to allow things like that to happen. 

So how can working with VR help you? VR agencies usually work with individuals who need more significant services. In some states, this includes intensive training, education, and rehabilitation services. They may also provide career counseling and job placement assistance, as well as counseling about how earnings from work affect Social Security disability benefits. I like to call them the big player. You know, you're going to get a lot of services, the heavy-duty expensive services from vocational rehabilitation agencies. Then you will get those services from a private EN. 

How do you find a service provider? There's a list of service providers you can get from calling the Ticket to Work Help Line. You know, again, free, no obligation. You just want information. You can call that number at 1-866-968-7842 or, for TTY users, 1-866-833-2762. I'm sorry I'm going to do that one again. 1-866-833-2967. For TTY users, again, they are available Monday through Friday, 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. and they will provide you with a list of providers in your area. Or you can use the online site. Again, the Find Help page, that's going to be in your Web pod as well. You can start at Choose Work, and you will get there as well. And you can search for your own providers. You can use your zip code. That's going to limit your search, right? You're not going to get 400 hits. You're going to get a couple that are near you. How about by services offered? You know, some people serve the blind. Some people serve people with deafness. Some take physical disabilities. Some have a preference for mental disabilities. You want an agency that can help you, so you can search by services that are offered. The disability type also. How about languages? If your primary language is Spanish, by all means, if you're comfortable working with somebody who speaks Spanish, search for that. And then the provider type. You know, you don't want to just get everything in your zip code. If you're looking for an EN, you know, you can click EN and limit your search. You know, if you need a workforce EN, click WF. VR agency, click VR. Or the PABSS agency, which is the Protection and Advocacy for Beneficiaries of Social Security, kind of the legal wing, if people have barriers to work. And search for the providers, one at a time, rather than all of them at once. I always find it easier to do three searches to get what I need limited, you know, rather than having a bunch of stuff thrown at me. All right, Derek, we're back to Q&A again. 

Derek >> Excellent, Ray, and we have plenty of time to continue to answer folks' questions. This is Derek again. Wanted to revisit the two most asked about things today; the Choose Work website, you know, the Contact page and that allows you to find that beneficiary Help Line telephone number and the Find Help Tool that you could generate a list of service providers. Those are both in the Web Links pod. So if you're saying, oh, that slide just went by. I don't have that — look in the Web Links pod, if you can, and access 12 and 13. That will get you that information, and we will repeat it one more time before wrapping up today. All right, Ray, you talked about, you know, accessing Employment Network services and the services and supports through, you know, an EN or a workforce EN, and then we got into the VR and their services. Speaking first with the Employment Networks, can you just revisit a little bit more about the types of services and supports that somebody could receive through an Employment Network when we think about kind of career counseling and job placement services and then, maybe after job acquisition, the ongoing? Just revisit some of those things. What are the things that you recall most Ticket Program services and supports helping people with? 

Ray >> Okay, if I am thinking about returning to work — I'm not sure — talking with an Employment Network is a good way to dispel some of the myths that you may have in your head right now that I'm going to lose everything if I go to work, those type questions. Somebody to talk to. You know, how do I as a person with a disability make this transition? Yeah, I don't know what I want to do. I don't know how much time I can work. Talk with an Employment Network. You don't have to worry about that. Yeah, you have someone to communicate with that will talk to you about that. You know, are you ready to start working? You know, what do you need? What services would you need to go to work? Well, clearly, it's been 20 years. I need my resume rebuilt. You know, even if it's been five years, I need my resume to rebuild. As a matter of fact, an EN can help you fill that gap. You know, you have had employers. Then you have a period of disability. Well, you didn't just have a disability. You know, there are things that you did while you were disabled. Maybe you volunteered someplace. Maybe you were watching your kids' kids. Anything you can potentially do. Maybe you learn to knit, and you're really into knitting, and you know all about the different wools and how to do all those stitches, and you've actually taught some friends. That's a great skill. Maybe a craft store is a good placement for you so that you can use something that you developed during that period of disability. You know, again, the Employment Networks also have benefits planners because I think it's critical that you know what will happen when it should happen, you know, so that I can tell you if you work at this level for the next nine months, your Trial Work Period will begin in January, and it will end in September. But remember, if something happens and you have an exacerbation, that period might be interrupted, so you need to call me again. So there are lots of things. You know, again, the resume prep, the interviewing skills that you're going to need. How about, you know, I need a job, you know, that's within 15 miles of my home. You know, so there's no public transportation. I have a car. It's kind of a beater now, but 15 miles, I'm comfortable driving that car each way. Well, that Employment Network likely knows the employers in your area where they're located and might just suggest that PASS plan. You know, not that you're going to be a car because that's not a vocational goal, but if you have a newer, more reliable car, your job search might expand in an area that you might be able to work more hours, you know, and that gives you reliability as well. You know, and we have had — I remember one gentleman from the state of Wisconsin who had a real clunker of a car, and his boss said if he had reliable transportation, he would give him a full-time job. And his work goal for the past became full-time employment, and he succeeded. You know, he got the car. He was working full time, and I hope he's still off benefits, working in that job. So there are lots of things the Employment Network can do beforehand. Now, the Employment Network can also help you get placed and work through your responsibilities. You know, what do you need to do? You need to report to Social Security. Well, what do I report? The name of the employer, the location, the name of your supervisor, what you're making, you know, and report your income every month to Social Security. Several ways to do that. We're not going to get into them now. And now you've realized that I've been working a couple of months, and I really, you know, need some extra support here. It's time for me to ask for a reasonable accommodation. You know, I need to spend another, you know, 10 minutes twice a day just getting away from everything to calm myself down, or that back impairment is causing pain, and I just need a little extra time to rest. How do I ask for that? Can you help me? You know, okay, now we're supporting you on the job, you know? So there's lots of stuff that that Employment Network can do before you work, while you're getting that job, and then on that job. So that's what an EN can do for you, keep working with you until you're ready, really seriously ready, to tell us I think I got it now. You know, we will then wave goodbye and wish you luck. But if something happens, remember us. You know, so lots of stuff, Derek. I mean, it's almost limited only by the employment plan that the person has developed with that Employment Network. 

Derek >> This is Derek. Ray, thanks a lot for these descriptions. I think they might be helpful for folks out there. You just mentioned you will wave goodbye, but then remember us in case you need to come back. We actually had a question today about somebody that worked with a Vocational Rehabilitation agency many years ago and then wants to know kind of like is eligibility still available? So talk to us a little bit about accessing VR services, you know, maybe more than once. But also talk to us a little bit about how Vocational Rehabilitation agencies can also work with handoffs to Employment Networks. 

Ray >> That's a great question, Derek, and I've mentioned that was possible, so I'm glad the question came up. It is possible. Now, remember, you have one Ticket. It can only be one place at one time. So if you need education, if you need extensive rehabilitation services, you might take your Ticket to the Vocational Rehabilitation agency. You know, again, they're going to help you get through school. They're going to help you to learn how to do maybe the same job differently because of your disability or use prosthetics or assistive technology to do some of your job and provide you with what you need, you know, the prosthetics and the assistive technology. They are going — they generally close your case after you are placed and work for three months at Substantial Gainful Activity levels. That's $1,620 countable earnings. So it's not your gross. We're going to use Work Incentives to chip away at that too. But if you do work three months, they consider it a successful closure. Now, what if that job's not working out? You know, what if you really want another job? What if you want more support as you go on? You know, now it's four months into this, and I'm really having a tough time, you know, keeping up with the 35 hours that I believed I could work, and I need to cut back. How do I talk to my employer about that? You know, what changes are going to occur to my benefits because of that? So what the Ticket allows through a program called Partnership Plus is to take your Ticket to VR, put it "in use" — and I'm giving you air quotes — "in use" is the status that will allow you to transfer it later. They will use that Ticket. They will get cost reimbursement from Social Security once you're successful. And again, that's three months at SGA levels after you've begun work. Now because it's in use, I can take that Ticket back and go to an Employment Network to get the follow-up services that I need. And I think this is just spectacular, Derek, I really, really do. It's the best of both worlds. Yeah, and what we're doing is taking you through a successful work experience, three months, and allowing you to have support for another nine months or 12 months so that you then are no longer, you know, a benefits recipient with a disability. You are a worker with a disability, you know, and that transition from recipient with a disability to worker with a disability is significant. It's a big step. And if we can extend that from the three months VR has to another nine months or a year, I think we can turn you into a worker with a disability. 

Derek >> Ray, thanks for that. I think we're going to leave it there. That is the objective for those of you that are interested in trying, or perhaps you're an ally or an advocate for a family member, or you're part of the service provider team out there. That's what we want. We want to support those Social Security beneficiaries who are eligible to find their way to work and provide the services and supports, whether it's through your Vocational Rehabilitation agency or through an Employment Network. So Ray, thank you for leading us through what is Ticket to Work in this Work Incentive Seminar Event. 

Ray >> Thank you. 

Derek >> All right, with that, let's turn to wrap up everyone. As you've learned today, the Ticket to Work Program has a variety of service providers and other detailed resources ready to answer your questions. To start, we have a couple suggestions. First of all, there's no wrong point of entry. Ray was saying this. What's important is for you to reach out to — in a way that you're comfortable. You can contact the Ticket to Work Help Line and speak to a beneficiary support specialist by calling 1-866-968-7842 or, via TTY, at 1-866-833-2967. That TTY line is a phone number for people who are deaf, hard of hearing, or have a speech disability and prefer to use a text telephone to make and receive calls. These numbers are available Monday through Friday, 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. Eastern Time, and we encourage you to reach out. Or you can visit us online at the Ticket to Work website at any time. That's choosework.ssa.gov. You'll find details regarding the topics covered by Ray in our webinar. Choose Work also has great information and resources on the Work Incentives we discussed, and that's where you can access the Find Help Tool that was described earlier to generate your Employment Network or other service provider contact information. 

Next, we have some suggestions on how to connect. We also encourage you, if you're interested, to connect with us in the ways that you like. You can find us on social media or subscribe to the Choose Work blog and receive other email updates and success stories by visiting choosework.ssa.gov/connect — or excuse me, contact. That's at that Choose Work contact page. This link also appears down in the Web Links pod that I mentioned at item 13. Next, to get on — info on our next webinar and receive advice and encouragement or read stories about people who have achieved financial independence with the help of the Ticket Program, you can opt in to receive text messages. And we encourage you to do that if you're interested. To do so, please reach out to us via text at Ticket, TICKET to 1-571-489-5292. Please know that standard messaging rates may apply. Again, join us via the text-messaging program to get continuous updates from us. And of course, you can always send us an email if you prefer at tickettowork@ssa.gov. And importantly, our next Work Incentive Seminar Event, or WISE webinar, is scheduled for July 30, from 3:00 to 4:30 p.m. Eastern Time. This session will be on Ticket to Work and Reasonable Accommodations. Registration is now open and available at choosework.ssa.gov/wise. Or you can reach out to that  Help Line at 1-866-968-7842. Or, if you prefer the TTY line, use 1-866-833-2967. Thank you again for attending today's webinar on What is Ticket to Work? This ends our webinar.